fluid-work IRC Logs-2008-08-11

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[09:31:52 EDT(-0400)] * Bosmon (n=Antranig@ginger.caret.cam.ac.uk) has joined #fluid-work
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[10:29:24 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i got the fluid reorderer working in the portal while keeping all the uportal javascript stuff working
[10:29:29 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> it seems to all be functional now
[10:29:33 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> athena7: Wow!
[10:29:38 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> What was the trick?
[10:29:44 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> not using fluid-all.js
[10:29:48 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark>
[10:29:57 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> and adding some better namespacing to the uportal js
[10:30:20 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> Fluid-all.js is a bit heavy-handed, since it includes everything. That's one of our fixes for 0.5... a build system that lets you choose dependencies at a more fine-grained level.
[10:30:21 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> some of which matt polizzotti had already done
[10:30:26 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> Cool.
[10:30:29 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah, makes sense
[10:30:50 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i'm sure including some of the jquery ui modules twice didn't help
[10:30:59 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> but yeah, i think we're all set
[10:31:12 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> it'd be great if we could get the more fine-grained layout customizer working eventually
[10:31:19 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> but the reorderer seems to work right now
[10:31:34 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> and the reorderer does the equivalent of what the portal javascript was doing
[10:34:52 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> athena7: Bosmon and michelled have been hacking away at the Reorder for 0.5, and it's already significantly faster.
[10:35:02 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> oh nice!
[10:35:04 EDT(-0400)] * athena7 cheers
[10:35:09 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> So I'm hoping that will be the version we get into uP3.1.
[10:35:17 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> gary had made some nice CSS for the different classes, too
[10:35:17 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> Even if we have to cut an interim release.
[10:35:20 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah that'd be great
[10:35:28 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> Awesome. I'm looking forward to seeing it.
[10:35:34 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> maybe we can include the slower version in the code now for the time being, the replace it?
[10:35:49 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> athena7: yep, that's exactly what I was thinking.
[10:35:57 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> i'd like to get the javascript file names set up such that long-term cache filters can be applied to them, too
[10:36:04 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> Yes, that makes a lot of sense.
[10:36:14 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> What are you thinking?
[10:36:25 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> jquery.js instead of jquery-[version].js and so on?
[10:36:27 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[10:36:32 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> makes sense.
[10:36:46 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> there's been some talk about maybe gzipping as well
[10:37:02 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> although i don't know if it makes more sense to do that at the apache level
[10:37:08 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> It might.
[10:37:33 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> yeah
[10:37:50 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> at the very least, documentation about how you might accomplish that would be excellent
[10:39:33 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> makes sense, yes
[10:40:12 EDT(-0400)] * Justin_o (n=Justin@142.150.154.101) has joined #fluid-work
[11:17:43 EDT(-0400)] * anastasia (n=team@142.150.154.160) has joined #fluid-work
[11:54:09 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> yes, I was just talking in standup about how to eliminate the "on drag" delay from the Reorderer
[11:54:31 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> But very sadly, the only practical way to do this would probably be to disuse the rest of JQuery UI draggable engine
[11:54:59 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Already in my last fix on Friday, we disused a lot more of it, since there is no way to get 100% consistency with its idea of drop targets whilst we continue to use its "drop" notifier
[11:57:25 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: I've filed 3 new Jiras which relate to the Reorderer and DnD. Fluid-1122, Fluid-1124, Fluid-1125
[11:57:30 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Justin_o: Thanks
[11:58:09 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Darn
[11:58:54 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> which one are you looking at?
[11:59:02 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> 1122
[12:00:09 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Awful, awful, awful
[12:00:15 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> oh.. yah.. kind of the opposite problem as before...
[12:00:26 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> 1125 seems to "not exist"
[12:00:33 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Did you mean 1123?
[12:00:50 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> oops.. yes.. you are right..
[12:00:55 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> should be 1123
[12:03:20 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> I won't be able to work on the IE issue today, since I didn't bring my laptop in
[12:03:38 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Would be appreciated if someone who has access to a proper IE debugger can get me an accurate line number
[12:03:53 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> The other two are very regrettable but solvable issues
[12:04:30 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> hmm... if you could tell me of a proper IE debugger.. i could try to figure it out for you.
[12:04:35 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> ok
[12:04:40 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> thanks
[12:04:46 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> You need to install that blasted Microsoft "Visual Web Developer" thingit
[12:05:12 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> It won't install on my machine here since it is Windows 2000
[12:05:47 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> http://www.berniecode.com/blog/2007/03/08/how-to-debug-javascript-with-visual-web-developer-express/
[12:06:04 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> This is the one I have used... it "often" works
[12:06:51 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> okay.. thanks.. i'll try to get it up and running. it's probably a good idea for me to have a proper debugger so I can give all the developers better information
[12:07:13 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Yes, even knowing an accurate line number can often be enough to fix an issue
[12:07:39 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> i'll let you know what I find
[12:07:43 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon>
[12:07:44 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Cheers
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[12:24:24 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Justin_o: I have resolved FLUID-1122
[12:24:39 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> But I can't reproduce FLUID-1124
[12:25:04 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: that's good...
[12:25:25 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: for fluid-1124 did you move the lightbox portlet first
[12:26:01 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> yes
[12:26:09 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> I tried with various portlets, including the lightbox
[12:26:15 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> And I always seem to be able to move them to a column end...
[12:26:43 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Ah!
[12:26:45 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> sorry... maybe there is some confusion... you have to move the lightbox portlet to some place
[12:26:47 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> I think I can see it now
[12:26:59 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> You cannot move to the column end whilst dragging down
[12:27:11 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> But if you go below the end of the column and then drag upwards again, the block appears
[12:27:18 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> and then move an image inside it to the last place
[12:29:12 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> OK, I see what you mean now
[12:30:17 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Yes, it is definitely related to FLUID-856
[12:30:20 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> (in my opinion)
[12:30:26 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Which was something I was about to start working on....
[12:31:16 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> I expect what has happened is that the same DOM elements have had multiple event handlers added to them
[12:32:08 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> And therefore there are two Reorderers trying to service the same events
[12:32:32 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> yes... it would make sense that they are related..
[12:33:13 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> i think i might file a bug about what you were looking at too as i believe that you are supposed to be able to drop a portlet at the end of a column
[12:33:25 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Yes
[12:33:36 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> thanks for pointing that out
[12:33:39 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> It is possible, but it has become "more awkward" to bring up the droppable marker there
[12:35:01 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> I think I know the reason for that too..
[12:36:07 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> i'll create a jira for it and pass you the number so you can comment on it.. or i can just assign it to you... up to you
[12:36:12 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> How in the name of MIKE are we going to create test cases for these things
[12:38:05 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Do you think there is any way we can synthesise very fine-grained mouse events?
[12:38:26 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> For example, a very long, infinitesimal little stream of mouse events?
[12:39:31 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> not that I know of.. i'm looking into that for my automated testing as I haven't been able to properly simulate drag and drop
[12:58:08 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: fluid-1125 is about the drop target not showing right away when moving up from the bottom...
[13:08:18 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Justin_o: Thanks
[13:08:25 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> I think this was actually an issue we have always had
[13:08:43 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> And there is a further related issue which has not yet been JIRAed, but has infuriated me for a long time, which is "jitter"
[13:08:56 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> If you drag left across a lightbox, there is an irritating "dead zone" between the gaps where we see no drop target
[13:09:10 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> It is like dragging a stick along a metal railing
[13:09:25 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> hmm... i'm trying to picture it
[13:09:27 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Both of these related to the way we are (using JQuery UI to) determine where a "drop target" is
[13:09:45 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Justin_o: Just at the moment the mouse pointer is dead centre between two lightbox cells, the drop target goes missing
[13:09:56 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Essentially because you are over some CSS spacing that is not actually assigned to any drop target
[13:10:18 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> It is just the sort of thing that gives geeks a bad name
[13:10:20 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> okay i think i understand.. you mean that there should always be a drop target
[13:10:28 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> lol
[13:10:34 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> And lets people with visual sensibility conclude that geeks could never design a visually proficient UI
[13:11:23 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> well we'll have to fix that then... i'll file it
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[13:13:41 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> Bosmon, sorry to interrupt, but a quick question: Is the undo functionality ready to go?
[13:14:04 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> or at least, do you expect that it is ready to go?
[13:18:26 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> anastasia: Yes, I am not aware of any problems with it
[13:19:01 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> Any thoughts on how it could properly be used with the 'multiple' version of inline edit initalisation, i.e. fluid.inlineEdits(), which initalizes a whole bunch of editors?
[13:19:44 EDT(-0400)] * athena7 (n=athena7@adsl-99-149-83-32.dsl.wlfrct.sbcglobal.net) has joined #fluid-work
[13:21:20 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> hm. actually, it doesn't seem to work properly if more than one editor exists on the page, even if they were all initialized separately.
[13:21:50 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> I edited the manual test page to add undoability to another editor, and both 'undo' links show up when one is edited
[13:21:56 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> Poor Bosmon's got a lot on his plate.
[13:22:03 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> I can try to look into the undo issues later today.
[13:22:06 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark>
[13:22:15 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> I'm happy to investigate, I just wanted to check if it was a known issue or not
[13:22:33 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> cool
[13:23:36 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Gah
[13:23:41 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Yes, JQuery droppable must die
[13:23:46 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon>
[13:24:00 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> I'll reopen FLUID-780...
[13:26:40 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> anastasia: Did you commit your changes to the manual test page?
[13:31:13 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> no
[13:31:27 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> I can, if you want me to
[13:31:43 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Yes, please
[13:32:53 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> ok, committed - the first item is also undoable
[13:35:32 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> Bosmon, I can look into this if you like - I know you're in the middle of other stuff...
[13:37:28 EDT(-0400)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: Fluid-1127 is the jitter-bug that you mentioned
[13:51:33 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> jitterbug, jitterbug....
[14:09:21 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> GLARG
[14:34:43 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> anastasia: OK, Fluid-780 is resolved (again)
[14:35:08 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Just as well we had the beginning of that "mini-IoC" architecture....
[14:35:38 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> cool - thanks!
[14:35:40 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Unfortunately, now our troubles are just beginning
[14:35:52 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> I will go off to dinner and think what we can possibly do about our draggability problems....
[14:37:08 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Reading the Facebook source shows that they use a very different kind of idiom to achieve their behaviour
[14:37:16 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> Which is not anything that could be commensurated with what JQuery UI does for us
[14:38:30 EDT(-0400)] <Bosmon> What our designers tell us is that they want behaviour that is i) fast, and ii) like Facebook
[14:41:52 EDT(-0400)] * colinclark (n=colin@142.150.154.101) has joined #fluid-work
[15:17:36 EDT(-0400)] * simonwang (n=chatzill@swang.itservices.ubc.ca) has joined #fluid-work
[15:23:05 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> Hi when I integrate fluid into up3, I got "el.setAttributeNS is not a function" at Fluid-all.js line 4153. Can some tell me what's wrong?
[15:24:02 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> hi, simonwang, let me just check what that line is
[15:24:15 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> are you using v0.4?
[15:24:33 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> the source package?
[15:25:28 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> Yes
[15:25:45 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> hm. this is a browser issue - what browser are you using?
[15:26:28 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.8.1.16) Gecko/20080702 Firefox/2.0.0.16
[15:27:04 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> so firefox 2? hm... that should be fine...
[15:28:11 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> Are you actually running Firefox 2, or another environment that simulates FF2?
[15:30:45 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> I use Windows XP with Firefox version 2.0.0.16 installed. I use Firebug to debug the application. I tried IE. It did not work, but I don't know what happened.
[15:31:37 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> hm.
[15:32:26 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> that line is simply trying to add a name-spaced attribute to an element.
[15:33:06 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> The call to el.setAttributeNS() is specifically used in the case of FF2...
[15:33:12 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> let me try it here on my machine
[15:33:34 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> are you working on portal reordering? with the layout customizer?
[15:35:34 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> yes. I collect the portal column-channel data and then call fluid.initLayoutCustomizer. It stopped at that line.
[15:35:53 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> ok, I'm starting up my VM...
[15:37:46 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> hm. I'm unable to replicate that error.
[15:37:59 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> Do you want to email me a copy of the file you're working on?
[15:38:21 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> the html and javascript?
[15:38:59 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> Sure. What is your email address?
[15:39:12 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> a dot cheetham at utoronto dot ca
[15:39:54 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> I will send the changes I made. Thanks!
[15:40:07 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> no problem - hopefully we can get this sorted out
[16:07:54 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> simonwang: You get the setAttributeNS() is not a function error when you're selecting a portlet or column that doesn't exist.
[16:08:12 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> We could do with better error reporting, but it points to an error in your selectors, presumably.
[16:08:27 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> We ran into this issue when Gary integrated the Layout Customizer into uPortal.
[16:08:41 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> What are you working on at the moment, and how is your integration different from the work that Gary has done?
[16:13:27 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> Gary' integration calls fluid.reorderLayout, my integration calls fluid.initLayoutCustomizer.
[16:15:04 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> simonwang: Aha. Cool. So you're going to work on getting the portal to generate the correct JSON data structures for the layout and the permissions?
[16:17:09 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> I'm trying to do that. But the first step just pass null as the permission, and add it later.
[16:20:26 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> colinclark, thanks for the help. I didn't know about the issues Gary had
[16:24:46 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> colinclark: you mentioned that the error was caused by a portlet or column doesn't exist. I call fluid.initLayoutCustomizer() this way (I tested putting the commas at the end of the components, and it works):
[16:24:48 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> fluid.initLayoutCustomizer (
[16:24:49 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> { id:"portalPageBodyColumns",
[16:24:51 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> columns:[
[16:24:52 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang>
[16:24:54 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> {id:"inner-column_u4l1s9",
[16:24:55 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> children:[
[16:24:57 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang>
[16:24:58 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> "portlet_u4l1n10",
[16:25:00 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang>
[16:25:01 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> "portlet_u4l1n15",
[16:25:03 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang>
[16:25:04 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> ]
[16:25:06 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> },
[16:25:07 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang>
[16:25:09 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> {id:"inner-column_u4l1s13",
[16:25:10 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> children:[
[16:25:12 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang>
[16:25:14 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> "portlet_u4l1n14",
[16:25:16 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang>
[16:25:18 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> "portlet_u4l1n11",
[16:25:20 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang>
[16:25:22 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> ]
[16:25:24 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> },
[16:25:26 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang>
[16:25:28 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> {id:"inner-column_s109",
[16:25:30 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> children:[
[16:25:32 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang>
[16:25:34 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> "portlet_n134",
[16:25:36 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang>
[16:25:38 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> ]
[16:25:40 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> },
[16:25:42 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang>
[16:25:44 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> ]
[16:25:46 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> }
[16:25:48 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> , null, null, options);
[16:33:38 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> simonwang: Could you use a pastebin to send code?
[16:33:47 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> It's usually a little easier to read than trying to cut and paste
[16:34:05 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> anastasia: What paste bin do we usually use?
[16:34:23 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> http://fluid.pastebin.com/
[16:41:04 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> anyone here know what version numbers of jaria and jquery.keyboard-a11y are included in the fluid distribution? i'd like to include the version numbers in the filenames
[16:43:37 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> athena7: the jquery.keyboard-a11y plugin is a Fluid deliverable (at least for now)...
[16:43:43 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> So it carries the Fluid version number.
[16:43:48 EDT(-0400)] <athena7> oh ok, great
[16:44:00 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> jARIA, on the other hand...
[16:44:06 EDT(-0400)] <colinclark> I'm not sure. I don't think it's ever been formally versioned.
[17:08:56 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> colinclark: I just pasted the parameters calling fluid.initLayoutCustomizer to fluid.pastebin.com
[17:10:48 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> simonwang, can you give us the link to use to access it? (it should be there on the page)
[17:14:44 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> anastasia: that is my test server inside of the firewall.
[17:18:54 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> we can't access the code you pasted into pastebin without the link that pastebin provides you, simonwang
[17:19:14 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> after you pasted the code into pastebin and hit 'send', the URL would have changed to something with a unique code in it
[17:19:19 EDT(-0400)] <anastasia> you have to give us that new url
[17:20:13 EDT(-0400)] <simonwang> I will find a way of doing it.
[18:23:22 EDT(-0400)] * phiggins (n=dante@c-68-34-199-67.hsd1.tn.comcast.net) has joined #fluid-work
[22:17:48 EDT(-0400)] * colinclark (n=colin@bas1-toronto09-1279543344.dsl.bell.ca) has joined #fluid-work