fluid-work IRC Logs-2013-02-07

[09:30:01 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> Hey michelled and yzen, sorry to distract you from your pairing session--I just wanted to check with you guys if you are on the GPII UX mailing list?

[09:30:24 CST(-0600)] <michelled> I'm not sure - probably not

[09:30:34 CST(-0600)] <yzen> colinclark: probably not

[09:30:35 CST(-0600)] <michelled> I'll join it - do you have a link colinclark?

[09:30:53 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> http://lists.gpii.net/mailman/listinfo

[10:11:50 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> jvass, jessm: I was just looking for some links to latest PCP/PMT designs for an email I'm writing. I stumbled across Christophe's meeting notes from Monday, which links to some designs: http://wiki.gpii.net/index.php/User_Preferences_UX_Meeting_2013-02-05

[10:11:53 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> But the links are both dead

[10:11:58 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> did they move? die? just bad links?

[10:12:49 CST(-0600)] <jessm> colinclark: oye. they moved

[10:13:04 CST(-0600)] <jessm> http://wiki.fluidproject.org/display/fluid/Cloud+for+All

[10:13:09 CST(-0600)] <jvass> yes, here now: http://wiki.fluidproject.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=34570514

[10:13:12 CST(-0600)] <jessm> why didn't the links update?!

[10:13:40 CST(-0600)] <jessm> colinclark: i can update the links

[10:13:45 CST(-0600)] <jvass> and here http://wiki.fluidproject.org/display/fluid/%28C4A%29+Preference+Management+Tool+Mockups

[10:14:12 CST(-0600)] <jvass> hm, weird maybe because i moved the files to different pages?

[10:14:45 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> I think probably attachments don't get redirected

[10:14:49 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> though renamed pages do

[10:14:59 CST(-0600)] <jessm> ok, i've changed the links on C4A

[10:15:07 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> thanks

[10:15:11 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> sorry to distract you

[13:37:50 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: would you be able to look at that pull request i sent yesterday about invokeGlobalFunction

[13:38:02 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> Justin_o - my IE8 is broken at the moment

[13:38:10 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> It now refuses to start up at all....

[13:38:18 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: so it's working

[13:39:52 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: would you be able to look at the code changes at least and see if they seem reasonable

[13:40:02 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> Justin_o - I am sure they are reasonable

[13:40:07 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> Bosmon:

[13:40:07 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> thanks

[13:41:32 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> If you can find someone to certify that it works, I am happy to push it : P

[13:41:38 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> Although I'm not sure that's the proper protocol...

[14:16:41 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: okay.. um if you end up chatting with michelle and/or yura about your changes perhaps they could screen share with you to show you there IE 8 running the change

[14:17:02 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> colinclark: hows it going?

[14:17:23 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: or i could screen share with you if you want.. or you could recommend someone else to do the review and pushing

[14:17:45 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> hey thealphanerd

[14:17:46 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> good

[14:17:50 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> how are you?

[14:17:54 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> doing well

[14:18:00 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> we need to discuss flocking!

[14:18:07 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> sure!

[14:18:21 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> I talked to julius and he is totally in to me doing some work on flocking this quarter as my independent research

[14:18:29 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> so before we were talking about osc

[14:18:40 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> and midi

[14:18:43 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> ooh, that's really cool

[14:20:07 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> but I was also thinking it might be nice to implement a unit generator or two or possibly a synth def

[14:20:16 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> maybe port something from the stk

[14:20:28 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> that would be fantastic!

[14:20:37 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: also have a question for your about the jqUnit changes...

[14:21:04 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> i'm getting an error now that says Called start() while already started (QUnit.config.semaphore was 0 already)

[14:21:09 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> cool!

[14:21:14 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> i'm still digging but it looks like start is only called once

[14:21:21 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> Justin_o - yes, that is caused by there formerly having been an undetected error in your tests

[14:21:40 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> I found several of those when I updated

[14:21:45 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> so I was brainstorming about osc… and I was thinking that it could maybe be implemented in a way that we get a bunch of stuff for free

[14:21:49 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> based off how faust does it

[14:21:59 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: oh.. is there a common fix?

[14:22:21 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> if a section was added to the synth def for describing the interface… sliders, pots, keyboard, etc

[14:22:23 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> Justin_o - the fix is to make sure you have actually called stop first

[14:22:54 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> then a free function within flocking (such as flock.osc) could be called on the synth def to automagically generate the osc server

[14:23:08 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: i thought we didn't have to call stop.. I thought we just needed to muse asyncTest

[14:23:16 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> Justin_o - that will also do

[14:23:19 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> the same model could be used to generate midi, or later down the road a gui

[14:23:33 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> If you have used asyncTest, then you will indeed somehow have called start() twice

[14:24:18 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: i'm confused.. does asyncTest call start itself now?

[14:24:51 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> or you mean that it definitely means i have to calls to start() in my test

[14:24:55 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> or jqUnit.start() that is

[14:26:17 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> I mean it definitely means you have two calls to jqUnit.start()

[14:26:23 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> If you have used asyncTest

[14:26:43 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> The old QUnit used to be lenient, in allowing that you just had "at least as many calls to start as stop"

[14:26:48 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> The new one insists that they match precisely

[14:28:44 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: thanks.. looks like there is a listener that is firing twice and that listener contains the call to jqUnit.start

[14:29:44 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> Justin_o - that is usually the way

[14:30:00 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: thanks for the help..

[14:30:07 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> yzen, michelled - we could have a short spell of review now?

[14:30:17 CST(-0600)] <yzen> sounds good Bosmon

[14:30:47 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> colinclark: thoughts?

[14:30:55 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> one sec, sorry

[14:30:57 CST(-0600)] <michelled> Bosmon: yes

[14:35:14 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> no problem

[14:35:26 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> thealphanerd: It sounds like an interesting idea

[14:35:39 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> we'd have to talk it through a bit more so that I was sure I fully understood it

[14:35:59 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> I was thinking that it wouldn't be as flexible as manually writing everything… BUT, if you were going to manually do everything why include it in flocking

[14:36:09 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> yup, exactly

[14:36:15 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> PLUS, if it works nicely as a free function, it could be used outside of flocking too

[14:36:17 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> I think you're entirely right to say that we can build a nice abstraction that can support both MIDI and osc seamlessly

[14:36:53 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> and interace rendering eventually too… which could introduce some interesting way of doing live coding (live visualization of interface)

[14:37:49 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> SIDEBAR, I'm taking a class in systems this quarter. This week I had to implement a vector and a map in c with only the standard lib.. I totally understand now why private / public is horrible

[14:39:36 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> oh cool

[14:39:53 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> what did you conclude, from the experience?

[14:40:51 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> that you shouldn't be the one to decide what your users see or don't see

[14:41:48 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> for both the reasons of debugging a use cases. It is arrogant to think that you know better than the user, and to do things for their safety. I understand with a language like C, when you are doing really tricky pointer arithmatic that things can get hairy… but to lock the client out because it isn't safe is not the answer

[14:42:58 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> this idea that you know better than the client, and should dictate what functions they use and don't use… that you will have helper functions that the client cannot access… well it might make sense, I think it causes more harm than good. If your code isn't doing what you want it too… you should be able to take a peak inside and tell why

[14:43:22 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> and if you want to do something with it outside the scope of it's initial intent… why not

[14:43:41 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> michelled: i pushed up my changes for FLUID-4661 to my branch in github https://github.com/jobara/videoPlayer/tree/FLUID-4661

[14:44:00 CST(-0600)] <michelled> thanks Justin_o

[14:44:16 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> the changes include an update to infusion and jqUnit based on my FLUID-4794 branch and it fixes the unit tests to work with the new version of jqUnit

[14:58:07 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: when multiple demands blocks are both valid, which one is used?

[14:59:35 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> Justin_o - this has just changed

[14:59:38 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> Consult FLUID-4392

[15:03:15 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> As for your PUL request, I think it is isn't necessary that particularly I see it, but the crucial moral issue is that someone other than the submitter needs to see it

[15:03:35 CST(-0600)] <Bosmon> It sounds like this has happened

[15:04:08 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: in regards to the pull request.. yes I believe michelled has seen it

[15:04:44 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: for FLUID-4392 i looked it over but don't see where the new behaviour is mentioned

[15:04:46 CST(-0600)] <michelled> yes, I did

[15:28:23 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> michelled: take a look at my FLUID-4794 branch now.. I have uploader basically working with our changes to Progressive Enhancement. https://github.com/jobara/infusion/tree/FLUID-4794

[15:28:48 CST(-0600)] <michelled> cool! thx Justin_o

[15:29:07 CST(-0600)] <Justin_o> michelled: welcome, please let me know what you think when you've had a chance to look at it

[15:29:14 CST(-0600)] <michelled> ok

[20:31:01 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> hey thealphanerd, sorry I was so distracted earlier today

[20:31:02 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> meetings, meetings, meetings

[20:31:03 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> i'm just going to catch up on what you said

[20:31:15 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> word

[20:31:25 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> let me know when you want to chat!

[20:31:28 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> I need to ask you some questions abotu flocking in node

[20:31:33 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> sure

[20:43:25 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> thealphanerd: Do you want to schedule some time to talk tomorrow or next week?

[20:46:15 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> Tomorrow would be great

[20:46:16 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> skype?

[20:46:22 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> I have class from 10 am to 11 am my time

[20:46:39 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> I could grab a quick lunch and we could meet at like 3 pm your time

[20:50:31 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> Skype is cool

[20:50:31 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> let me check my calendar

[20:50:59 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> 3 pm works for me tomorrow

[20:56:44 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> amazing

[20:56:46 CST(-0600)] <thealphanerd> let's do it!

[20:57:27 CST(-0600)] <colinclark> cool. it's in my calendar