fluid-work IRC Logs-2009-03-04

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[09:55:49 EST(-0500)] * Topic is 'Happy Square Root Day, everyone!' set by anastasiac on 2009-03-03 14:35:31 EST(-0500)
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[12:33:35 EST(-0500)] * Topic is '"!"' set by anastasiac on 2009-03-04 11:17:58 EST(-0500)
[12:35:26 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> small question for component developers:
[12:35:54 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> for the dynamic class name styles definition objects "styles":{} found in components
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[12:36:22 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> are those added purely for user defined styles, or do we need them to do other things?
[13:15:08 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> fj4000: Just saw your message here.
[13:15:12 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> Did you get a response?
[13:15:20 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> no, but your timing is perfect
[13:15:27 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> I was about to send off an email about this
[13:15:32 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> ok
[13:15:42 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> Not quite sure what you're asking. Can you elaborate?
[13:15:45 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> sure
[13:16:33 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> when we go through the styles object and write out those class names, do we try to find them later or do anything with them? I know it sounds crazy, but it helps to be sure
[13:16:48 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> I would think they're just for CSS alone
[13:17:11 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> fj4000: There's no particular requirements for how a developer uses things in the styles: {} option.
[13:17:35 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> But I expect that vast majority of the time will be spent doing add/removeClass() with them.
[13:17:44 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> and nothing more, right?
[13:17:52 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> at least, not normally
[13:17:58 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> Generally not, that's right.
[13:18:04 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> okillee dokille
[13:18:09 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> *dokilee
[13:18:42 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> For reasons you know, we try to encourage component developers to store meaningful state inside their component, so they generally won't need to select based on a style class.
[13:19:06 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> And if they do, your argument of separating finding from styling already covers that case.
[13:19:16 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> yup - something i just wanted to clarify before sending out that email about selectors
[13:20:33 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> cool
[13:20:46 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> Justin_o: I sent that email yesterday about dates for the 1.0 release.
[13:20:54 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> You've got a big stake in this decision, so be sure to respond.
[13:21:18 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> A bit of push and pull on the dates is natural, so don't hesitate to say "sorry guys, I need more time."
[13:21:51 EST(-0500)] <Justin_o> colinclark: Thanks... i read it over... i was just going to give other people a chance to way in to see what they were thinking, but i guess it's been long enough... now... i'll send out a response shortly
[13:22:17 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> makes sense
[13:22:23 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> whenever you like
[13:22:32 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> i interpret the silence as general agreement with those dates
[13:22:50 EST(-0500)] <Justin_o> that makes sense
[13:25:31 EST(-0500)] <michelled> yes, I'm fine with those dates. Ideally, I would be able to fit more days in before the end of the release and have lots of time for features as well as a long bug parade. But alas, I'm not that powerful
[13:25:43 EST(-0500)] <colinclark>
[13:25:49 EST(-0500)] <michelled> can't change the calendar
[13:25:58 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> We will be cutting an Infusion 1.1 release in April
[13:26:03 EST(-0500)] <Justin_o> I blame February for only having 28 days
[13:26:11 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> so we needn't over-emphasize this release
[13:26:20 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> or 1.01; whatever we want to call it
[13:26:28 EST(-0500)] <michelled> hard not to do when we call it 1.0 but I hear you
[13:26:47 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> well, here's the thing
[13:27:02 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> most people who are in production environments wait for a 1.1 release.
[13:27:09 EST(-0500)] * Topic is 'February is at fault' set by michelled on 2009-03-04 13:27:09 EST(-0500)
[13:27:12 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> we're going to focus on solidness for 1.0
[13:27:22 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> but we can't get everything all at once
[13:27:27 EST(-0500)] <colinclark> this product is alive, it'll keep growing
[13:27:34 EST(-0500)] <michelled> yup
[13:28:04 EST(-0500)] <michelled> fj4000: I've started to use a jquery ui slider in UI Options. I haven't yet committed this
[13:28:23 EST(-0500)] <michelled> one thing I've come up against is that I need the jQuery css file in order to see the slider
[13:28:27 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> sounds good
[13:28:43 EST(-0500)] <michelled> I assume we could use our own classes if we wanted to but I don't know if that makes sense
[13:28:50 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> i see
[13:28:58 EST(-0500)] <michelled> what do you suggest I do? add the file? add bits of the file?
[13:29:11 EST(-0500)] <michelled> how should this be integrated with FSS?
[13:29:31 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> this might be a good time to merge some stuff with FSS
[13:29:39 EST(-0500)] <michelled> I'm currently just linking to their file but this is clearly not the correct solution.
[13:29:40 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> colinclark and I discussed this a while back
[13:29:52 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> I could map their UI styles into our files
[13:29:58 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> see where that takes us
[13:30:13 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> but we wont be able to go as far as their own native styles do
[13:30:17 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> like with themeroller
[13:30:55 EST(-0500)] <michelled> do you think we should use themeroller to roll a fluid theme? that we ship?
[13:31:13 EST(-0500)] <michelled> or perhaps a theme for each of the fluid themes?
[13:31:16 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> i really dont know....
[13:31:19 EST(-0500)] <michelled> mist, rust hc etc
[13:31:40 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> there would be a LOT of content to ship then, wouldnt there?
[13:31:51 EST(-0500)] <michelled> likely
[13:32:55 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> im not really sure how to proceed here...it makes sense not to re-invent the wheel here, but that would mean a lot of messy crossover
[13:33:36 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> and fragile crossover too
[13:34:58 EST(-0500)] <michelled> perhaps I'll try to trim down my dependency and commit that. Then we can see what we can do with it. so we'd ship a subset of jqueries css - just enough to support the fluid component uses
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[16:00:45 EST(-0500)] <michelled> fj4000, are you there?
[16:06:18 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> yup
[16:06:29 EST(-0500)] <michelled> I just committed the work that I've been doing. It would be great if you could look at three things.
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[16:06:36 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> sure thing
[16:06:37 EST(-0500)] <michelled> 1. I committed the ui.slider.css file. I think that's the minimum required. I think we should decide what to do with this - probably role it into FSS.
[16:06:57 EST(-0500)] <michelled> 2. The slider is not oriented correctly in the sakai example. Slider has an orientation option - do you think I should set that or should I continue to use auto? If I use 'auto' then we'd need to take a look at the markup in the example to see why it's causing the vertical orientation.
[16:07:11 EST(-0500)] <michelled> 3. I implemented the strategy we talked about for minimum text size - setting the style attribute. However, in the uportal sample, this is being over-ridden. Do you think we need to come up with another strategy?
[16:08:23 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> so I opened UI Options.html
[16:08:29 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> and I see the slider, massive as it is
[16:08:37 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> but nothing happens when I drag it
[16:08:44 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> is this expected?
[16:10:56 EST(-0500)] <michelled> one thing should happen
[16:11:03 EST(-0500)] <michelled> the text box should change
[16:11:15 EST(-0500)] <michelled> the data binding is working yet for the slider
[16:11:19 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> ok
[16:11:22 EST(-0500)] <michelled> it's on my todo list
[16:11:23 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> so that much I see
[16:11:38 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> in the uPortal demo
[16:11:52 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> where is the class name for the base text size?
[16:12:04 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> which element are you working on?
[16:12:16 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> is it <HTML>?
[16:12:31 EST(-0500)] <michelled> there is no class name - remember you recommended that I not use a class name
[16:12:40 EST(-0500)] <michelled> yes, I'm working on html
[16:12:44 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> ok
[16:12:48 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> so here's the rub
[16:13:02 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> we need to move back to working on the body by default
[16:13:09 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> wait
[16:13:11 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> sorry bout that
[16:13:16 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> let me check something
[16:13:20 EST(-0500)] <michelled> k
[16:13:24 EST(-0500)] <michelled> take your time
[16:13:34 EST(-0500)] <michelled> I didn't actually expect you to have answers yet
[16:13:39 EST(-0500)] <michelled> I just wanted to pose all the questions
[16:13:58 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> yeah, we need to move back to the body as our default root node
[16:14:28 EST(-0500)] <michelled> hmmm... what will that do to other options where we do use class names
[16:14:50 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> it works fine for everything, except one visual feature
[16:15:12 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> when selecting a theme, the background color wont be for the entire page, but rather only for the size of the content on the page
[16:16:00 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> this is only annoying when the page's content is smaller than whats on your screen
[16:16:05 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> and only in certain browsers
[16:16:12 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> but its annoying none the less
[16:16:40 EST(-0500)] <michelled> everything has tradeoffs
[16:17:19 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> yes, and I think this is where I would gladly trade off (small content's background color) for (effective font sizing)
[16:17:30 EST(-0500)] <michelled> yes!
[16:17:33 EST(-0500)] <michelled>
[16:17:48 EST(-0500)] <michelled> ok, I'll change to using body.
[16:17:55 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> btw, when you set font size, did you mean to use px instead of pt ?
[16:18:43 EST(-0500)] <michelled> well, I used pt. and it seemed to work and means that I don't have to have map between pixels and points
[16:18:53 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> yes, thats what I was thinking too
[16:18:58 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> it seems to work pretty well
[16:19:29 EST(-0500)] <michelled> I haven't looked at it in IE. IE scares me
[16:20:04 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> I will look now
[16:20:50 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> of course, I mean once the root node change is made
[16:21:00 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> b/c nothing is different now anyways
[16:22:04 EST(-0500)] <michelled> ha
[16:22:45 EST(-0500)] <michelled> what do you think about the orientation issue in the sakai example?
[16:22:57 EST(-0500)] <michelled> should I explicitly set the orientation?
[16:23:10 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> im launching it now...
[16:23:26 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> whoa
[16:23:40 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> it looks like you might have to, yes
[16:23:46 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> is that the default?
[16:24:24 EST(-0500)] <michelled> the default is 'auto' and it decides how to display. I didn't look at the code
[16:24:55 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> it "decides" on its own? sounds frightening
[16:25:06 EST(-0500)] <michelled>
[16:27:26 EST(-0500)] <michelled> so, will you take a look then at incorporating the slider styles into fss? I guess they could be part of the ui options component css.
[16:27:38 EST(-0500)] <michelled> but that's presuming noone else would want to use a slider
[16:28:52 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> yes, im thinking a broader widget
[16:28:58 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> like tabs, columns, etc
[16:29:11 EST(-0500)] <fj4000> a slider was on the feature request list
[16:32:43 EST(-0500)] <michelled> thanks
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