...
[01:44:34 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> Yes
[01:44:42 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> It seems Microsoft themselves will ditch that lot in April
[01:44:51 CDT(-0500)] <colinclark> then perhaps it's time
[01:44:53 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> Even though I am still quite fond of XP myself.....
[01:45:02 CDT(-0500)] <colinclark> aren't we all, yes
[01:45:25 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> Millions of our users may be too
[01:45:37 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> But I guess none of them would expect any a11y features on using IE8 anyway
[01:46:56 CDT(-0500)] <colinclark> ARIA support wasn't great
[01:47:11 CDT(-0500)] <colinclark> though there are still a lot of users
[01:47:26 CDT(-0500)] <colinclark> since upgrades tend to be slower when AT is involved in the mix
[01:48:13 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> If push comes to shove, we could always have the framework monkey-patch isPlainObject by itself, using a browser detect
[01:48:31 CDT(-0500)] <colinclark> ok, my two udp-chattering robot buddies are shut down
[01:48:37 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> The awful issue is that IE8 and below will throw an exception when accessing the prototype or constructor properties of a "host object"
[01:48:44 CDT(-0500)] <colinclark> insane
[01:49:02 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> And, despite a JSfiddle to the contrary, having a try/catch block in this very innermost part of the framework would be completely unacceptable performance-wise
[01:49:21 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> Although I guess we could try getting the JSfiddle working properly, I didn't spend too much time with it
[01:50:06 CDT(-0500)] <colinclark> remind me what the nature of the performance impact with try/catch blocks is?
[01:50:17 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> It causes the VM to "deoptimise" the function containing them
[01:50:21 CDT(-0500)] <colinclark> ouch
[01:50:34 CDT(-0500)] <colinclark> both *Monkey and V8?
[01:51:07 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> Unknown.... we would have to "fiddle" that too : P Although testing performance on these micro-operations is always extremely fraught
[01:51:26 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> We really need a performance benchmark which assesses the performance of the framework as a whole on a sizeable task
[01:51:40 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> But that would reveal a number of other more serious problems
[01:51:54 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> I'm not sure that actually a "constructor" or "prototype"-based detection can be performant either
[01:52:09 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> Since if we require cross-frame resistance, it means calling "toString" on them
[01:52:14 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> Which can result in truly huge representations
[01:52:44 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> The great thing about the Object.prototype.toString test was that it only ever produces short and standard strings like [object Object] which can certainly be generated performantly
[01:55:52 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> https://github.com/jashkenas/underscore/pull/102
[01:55:57 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> Endless discussion on _ here
[09:46:18 CDT(-0500)] <michelled> Justin_o, cindyli, yzen: do you think it's possible to arrange for a pull request of the most recent prefs framework into the gpii repo?
[09:46:37 CDT(-0500)] <michelled> sorry, I mean the exploration tool
[09:46:47 CDT(-0500)] <michelled> the nightly for gpii is still showing the discovery tool
[09:46:59 CDT(-0500)] <michelled> and I'd rather not send links around that will be obsolete very soon
[10:11:44 CDT(-0500)] <Justin_o> michelled: sure... we could do that
[10:12:25 CDT(-0500)] <michelled> thanks Justin_o
[10:13:42 CDT(-0500)] <Justin_o> michelled: https://github.com/GPII/prefsEditors/pull/8
[10:13:57 CDT(-0500)] <michelled> cool - yzen can you review it?
[10:14:18 CDT(-0500)] <yzen> michelled: sure ill try to get to it today
[10:14:46 CDT(-0500)] <michelled> great!
[13:25:14 CDT(-0500)] <Justin_o> fluid-everyone: would anyone like to join the community meeting remotely. Today we will be doing another doc sprint.
[13:25:30 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> Sure, Justin_o - I will need a few minutes first
[13:25:43 CDT(-0500)] <anastasiac> Justin_o, yura just left, but he'll join once he's available again
[13:25:54 CDT(-0500)] <Justin_o> Bosmon, anastasiac okay.. thanks
[13:26:18 CDT(-0500)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: by the way.. i ran into an issue with the message resolver stuff.. if you have a couple minutes to chat with me about that, it would be helpful
[13:26:34 CDT(-0500)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: i left a comment on the jira about it http://issues.fluidproject.org/browse/FLUID-5180
[13:42:19 CDT(-0500)] <anastasiac> fluid-everyone: Planning page for today's Docs Sprint: http://wiki.fluidproject.org/display/fluid/Docs+Sprint+Planning
[13:43:27 CDT(-0500)] <anastasiac> jessm, vjoanna, clown: we have some apple cider donuts and girl guide cookies here in the collar room; feel free to come help yourself (we have too many!)
[13:47:18 CDT(-0500)] <Justin_o> anastasiac: http://wiki.gpii.net/index.php/Architecture_-_Available_transformation_functions
[14:04:23 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> Justin_o - is the meeting running now?
[14:08:46 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> Hi anastasiac
[14:09:00 CDT(-0500)] <anastasiac> hi, Bosmon, are you available for the docs sprint now?
[14:09:06 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> yes
[14:28:48 CDT(-0500)] <anastasiac> http://wiki.fluidproject.org/display/fluid/Docs+Sprint+Planning
[15:05:11 CDT(-0500)] <Justin_o> Bosmon: did you have a chance to look at the issue i'm having with FLUID-5180
[15:05:14 CDT(-0500)] <Justin_o> ?
[15:07:14 CDT(-0500)] <Bosmon> Justin_o - yes, I have commented on the JIRA
[15:08:28 CDT(-0500)] <Justin_o> great thanks.